When David Robertson discovered a mouse living in his minivan years ago, he knew it meant trouble. But what happened next - six weeks of Googling for information about mice, the viruses they carry, and the chances he might die from catching such an illness - was more than something a simple mousetrap could handle. It was indicative of the challenges Robertson faces every day, living with anxiety.

On this episode of Paternal, Robertson discusses all the ways that anxiety has affected his life as an award-winning author and a husband and father of five kids. He also reflects on what role masculinity played in him hiding the seriousness of his mental health issues, his thoughts on group therapy and medication, and why he’s chosen to use his platform to openly address mental health.

Sixteen years ago, novelist Charles Bock was the kind of guy who would never, ever want to appear on a podcast about fatherhood. He was single and living in New York City as an aspiring writer aching to finish his first novel and somehow get it published. He had no real desire to become a father, and he knew he was too immature to become anyone’s dad. And then he met Diana.

On this episode of Paternal, Bock discusses what happens when a man reluctantly becomes a father, and then faces a life-altering sequence of events that leaves him largely on his own to raise his daughter. He also recounts how he balanced grieving his wife's death and full-time caregiver responsibilities, all while his friends questioned if he was up to the task and the mothers in the preschool pickup line kept a safe distance from a father clearly in over his head.

In one of the tightest presidential elections in U.S. history, is it possible that thousands of disaffected young men might be the ones casting the deciding votes? Donald Trump certainly thinks it’s a possibility, and the former president has made a concerted effort to court these Gen Z men through interviews with a constellation of podcast and YouTube stars of the Manoverse. But what’s really driving these men to turn out for Trump, and will the strategy work?

On this episode of Paternal, Pulitzer Prize-winning reporter John Branch discusses what he learned from speaking with a variety of Gen Z men who have latched onto Trump as their savior. He also breaks down how the Trump campaign has attempted to define their candidate as the ultimate male superhero while attacking Democratic Vice Presidential candidate Tim Walz, bringing different definitions of masculinity to the forefront of the presidential election.

Over the past 10 years, Jason Reynolds has become one of the most prolific and celebrated writers working today. He writes for a young audience that he believes is ready to think about and discuss the hard things in life, and he recently added a MacArthur Genius Grant to his collection of awards earned for depicting the rich inner lives of kids of color, ensuring that they see themselves and their communities in literature.

But in his latest book, Reynolds is writing for the first time about boys’ emotions and questions surrounding sex and intimacy. And he’s also thinking about why no one ever asks boys or men about their complex interior lives when it comes to these  essential subjects. On this episode of Paternal, Reynolds discusses writing a love story for black boys, what he learned from his father about facing tough challenges in life, and how his father taught him to live a complete life, even on his deathbed.

Gary Vider is the son of a con man. His father Manny ran a series of schemes in and around New York City for years while Gary was growing up, including dozens of times when father and son conned their way into Madison Square Garden while posing as media members for Sports Illustrated for Kids. Gary met some of the biggest names in sports - John Elway, Mario Lemiuex, and even Michael Jordan - all because Manny had what all good con artists have: The ability to ignore all the possible consequences of his actions. “Most people can’t do it,” Gary says, “but my dad was the master.”

But what happens when those actions destroy a family, and leave a son isolated from his father for almost 25 years? On this episode of Paternal, Gary looks back on growing up with a con man for a father, what he learned by trying to reconnect with his dad decades later, and why it took becoming a father himself to question what he really knew or believed about his own dad.

Once you hear the story of the Black civil liberties group MOVE, it’s almost impossible to believe you never learned about it before. Dubbed by some as a cult and by others as revolutionaries in the mold of The Black Panther Party, MOVE members railed against racial injustice and inequality in Philadelphia during the 1970s and early 80s, frequently clashing with police. A number of MOVE’s members were either jailed or killed as a result, leaving its younger generation to make sense of the legacy of MOVE and how the group’s actions shaped their lives.

On this episode of Paternal, MOVE member Mike Africa, Jr. discusses his parents’ imprisonment for the murder of a police officer, and how he made peace with the knowledge that he was born in a Philadelphia jail cell. He also discusses meeting his father for the first time in prison, the experience of watching his father walk free after 40 years inside, and the challenges of raising his own kids in the shadow of MOVE.

After a particularly feverish Twitter rant in 2018 landed him an invite to write a guest opinion on boys and violence from The New York Times, Michael Ian Black had to ask one simple question: Are you sure you want me? After all, Black is best known as a sketch and standup comic, and a particularly snarky one at that. But he wrote the essay and it subsequently went viral, leading Black to eventually pen the 2020 memoir A Better Man: A (Mostly Serious) Letter To My Son, which offers a candid take on his own boyhood, the death of his father, and why he’s concerned for his own son’s future.

On this 2022 episode of Paternal, Black recounts his adolescent experience of desperately seeking all the secrets of manhood, why he tinged his own successful brand of humor with defensive sarcasm, why even the most influential male comics rarely delve into painful vulnerability, and where he failed and succeeded as a father to his two children.

Everyone at some point has ridden in the back of an Uber, but how often do we think about the people behind the wheel, or how they got there? Jonathan Rigsby had a master’s degree and a full-time job when he gave his first Uber ride, reeling from a painful divorce and seeking a way to help support his young son. But Uber’s promises of big bucks and a flexible schedule were soon replaced by long nights filled with despair as Rigsby realized he, like millions of other Americans, had been trapped in the cycle of the gig economy.

On this episode of Paternal, Rigsby recounts how his divorce led him to the brink of poverty and why he picked up a second job working long hours, but also what it’s really like to work for Uber, where wages are never quite what they seem and you can still feel lonely when the backseat is full.

Peter Doocy isn’t the first guest to appear on Paternal as the son of a very famous father, but he’s definitely the only one who can claim to have an “adverserial bromance” with President Joe Biden. As the Senior White House Correspondent for Fox News, Doocy’s made it his job since 2021 to pepper the president and members of his administration with questions about immigration, inflation or international affairs, and in the process has become one of the network’s most recognizable figures - just like his father.

On this episode of Paternal, Doocy discusses what it was like to grow up as the son of the affable “Fox and Friends” host Steve Doocy and if the family name ever held him back as a journalist, how he approaches fame, fatherhood and social media, and how becoming a dad himself has changed his opinion of Biden as the country’s most famous empathetic father figure.

Paternal celebrates Father’s Day with a special episode paying tribute to all the new dads out there celebrating the holiday for the first time. Three past guests are back on the show to offer their thoughts on the early days of fatherhood and the challenges of becoming a new father, but also on the value of patience, the power a village has to raise a child, and why it’s so important to reconsider what we mean when we think of the word “sacrifice.”

Guests on this episode of Paternal include author and professor Jesse Thistle, political commentator and attorney Bakari Sellers, and Senior Rabbi Steve Leder.

Michael Andor Brodeur is a “big man.” That’s the term he uses to describe himself after more than 30 years of lifting weights - some of those spent as a powerlifter, and all of those spent not just trying to get fit, but to get big. But for all the time he’s spent in the gym over the years, he’s probably spent just as much time thinking about the way men think about the connection between men, muscles, and masculinity.

On this episode of Paternal, Brodeur discusses the concept of getting big and why some men are so motivated to do so, the connection between how men build their bodies and their inability to express themselves emotionally, how some men use weightlifting to deal with issues like anxiety, grief and addiction, and why the gym is a place where men are free to fail and support one another when they do fail, two things they might not be encouraged to do in other parts of society.

If you were a child of the 1980s and early 1990s, you lived through a golden age for sitcom dads. From The Cosby Show to Growing Pains and Roseanne to The Simpsons, fathers of all kinds ruled the airwaves for roughly a decade, providing an entire generation of wide-eyed kids a glimpse into what a father should look like and, for better or worse, what a family can be. But did these portrayals of paternal figures do more harm than good, and how did Friends and Seinfeld land a fatal blow to the fate of sitcom dads?

Comedy historian and author Saul Austerlitz joins this episode of Paternal to take a deep dive on the history of the family sitcom, tracing the genre’s roots back to the dawn of television. He discusses how fathers were first portrayed in the 1950s and how they have evolved during each decade thereafter, including iconic sitcom dads on Leave it to Beaver, All in the Family, The Cosby Show, Married With Children, Roseanne, and The Simpsons.

Rob Flanagan is a husband and father who lives with his family outside of Boulder, Colorado, and roughly one year ago he and his wife Dana began an ordeal that changed their lives. After a few days of fighting a cold and a slight fever while missing out on attending kindergarten, their daughter Saoirse was suddenly hospitalized and then intubated, and it was unclear if she would ever wake up. 

On this episode of Paternal, Flanagan recounts the experience of spending days in the ICU with his wife while they awaited word on the health of their daughter, what the doctor’s diagnosis meant for their family, and how he learned to embrace both acceptance and hope on the path to becoming a better father.

Growing up on the Wasauksing First Nation indigenous reserve in Ontario, journalist and bestselling author Waubgeshig Rice learned early in his life about the value of culture and community. But as an Anishinaabe young man schooled in the challenges his ancestors faced as indigenous people in Canada, Rice was also keenly aware of what happens when a community loses its connection to its history, traditions and culture, and how men can easily fall victim to the effects of intergenerational trauma.

On this 2022 episode of Paternal, Rice recounts his experience on Wasauksing First Nation and his sometimes conflicted emotions about growing up on the reserve, as well as the challenges his own father faced in trying to reclaim the family’s Anishinaabe identity. Rice - who penned the celebrated apocalyptic thriller Moon of the Crusted Snow as well as the recently released follow-up Moon of the Turning Leaves, and was dubbed “one of the leading voices reshaping North American science fiction, horror and fantasy” by the New York Times - also discusses the emotional strain he experienced after the complicated birth of his first son, and how masculinity and vulnerability are valued on “the rez.”

Most people know Kwame Alexander as the Newbery Medal-winning author of The Crossover, the bestselling children’s book about two young brothers hooked on basketball. Long before he was an award-winning author, however, Alexander spent his time writing love poems, in an attempt to impress women and find his voice as a poet and a young man. 

But three decades and two marriages later, Alexander is a 54-year-old father of two now reconsidering those relationships from his past, and what exactly he knows - and doesn’t know - about love. And in order to do that, he’s thinking more about the marriage his parents modeled for him as a child, as well as what he learned about love and relationships from his father, a hard-nosed Baptist minister who rarely showed affection.

Longtime political journalist Tim Alberta spent more than three years speaking with pastors and churchgoers across the country in a search for answers about what’s happening in contemporary Evangelicalism. Why were so many congregations becoming more political, and seemingly less invested in traditional Christian values? Why were they so motivated by fear? How could so many Evangelicals support Donald Trump, who doesn’t share their beliefs? And what would all these dramatic changes mean for the future of Evangelicals in the United States?

On this episode of Paternal, Alberta discusses his life as an Evangelical Christian, the influence of his born-again Christian father, what he learned about Evangelicalism from speaking with today’s church leaders, and why some churchgoers confronted him at his own father’s funeral about politics in the era of Trump.